It doesn’t surprise me, at all, that my latest post “Go and learn, or go away” received the response it did. What did surprise me, however, was that the European WoW forum community understood my point far better than those reading my blog – the exact opposite of what I’d have expected.
It’s inherently unfortunate that the individuals chastising me failed to grip what I hoped were simple points (especially those who’ve known me for a long time), but that’s okay. I long ago gave up expecting reasonable discourse when disagreement arises.
All that said, I’ve chosen to create this entry in order to archive my responses on the WoW Europe forums seeing as a perfectly legitimate thread got locked. This will do two things:
1) Show I’m not making light of those disagreeing with me.
2) Those responding to my first blog get a better picture of where I’m coming from.
What’s wrong with learning in game?
Trial and error is an absolutely valid way of learning, and one I completely support; I got involved in a server-wide tanking project for just this very reason. It didn’t make it into my list for the sake of brevity, but I completely agree with you.
You’re speaking to someone who spent just under three hours in the Deadmines because the bear tank told me he was new and trying to learn.
Trying to learn.
If someone wants to improve and shows an interest in doing so, I would guess that all these “elitists” people hate would turn out to be some of the most helpful people you’ve ever come across in game.
Why should people have to put hours in the game to get YOUR seal of approval?
An extremely common complaint is travel time, even though it need never extend beyond ten minutes if you’re sensible. The point is that almost no matter what you want to do, you need only stand in your capital city and wait for a queue to pop.
How disassociating is queuing for a dungeon you have no clue about the location of?
Why should those who refuse to read the dungeon journal, or even their own tooltips, get rewarded with powerful items?
They shouldn’t. They are.
I’ve already said that in-game learning is perfectly valid, and there are a myriad of ways to do it. Please, can future posters not ask me this again?
It’s getting boring.
I’m not interested in lol RP.
I’m not confining “RP” to scripted events, I’m talking about immersion in the world-story (lore). I’ve read so many times that people have no real interest or care in Deathwing; how many said similar things about Arthas or Illidan?
I’m a casual player and object to your post.
My only objection is that "casual" is something of a misnomer; I know of many casuals with limited time, who still spend some of it trying to be better players. They also acutely understand that there is absolutely no reason whatsoever that they should be able to "see" everything just because they pay a subscription.
Absolutely. I’ve tried to allude to this already, but “casual” does NOT (no, not under any circumstances) mean “bad”.
Back during TBC, [name removed], I wasn’t a raider but had plenty of challenging content to play. Endgame dungeoneering was challenging, and heroic dungeons were a form of endgame for those without the time to raid. The brutal fact is that by making heroic dungeons absurdly easy, which they currently are, you are robbing casual players of viable endgame content.
You’re basically forcing them to try and raid because there’s nothing else for them to do if they want to challenge themselves. In short, because of dreadful players who resolutely refuse to improve, everyone is losing out. I don’t see what’s hard to grasp about this.
I’m entirely in support of your approach regarding in-game learning. By the sound of it, you were determined to learn how to play the content you had the time for and neither I, nor any sane person, would ever try and ostracise people like yourself.
You should be encouraged, and you make the game richer for your involvement.
Remember; casual does not mean bad.
For me, the definition of a casual player is someone who plays for less than 15 (pretty arbitrary, but “feels” right) hours a week.
This has absolutely nothing to do with their ability as a player.
Any argument to the contrary is flat-out wrong, and this has been pointed out by many people in this thread; multiple times by myself.
The dungeon finder wrecked the community.
The sad part is that the exact same thing happened to the community when the dungeon finder went live in Rift.
I preferred the TBC model with regard to linear progression and attunement that didn’t let people skip tiers.
The other positive aspect of this was that there was plenty of content for the vast majority of people - the fact you weren't at the latest tier didn't matter, because there was piles of content in front of you.
I unequivocally agree. Removing them [attunements], again, actually HURTS casual players who want to get involved in them. In a world of account and/or guild achievements, there is no reason for their omission.
Content is only easy because of that gear you’re so proud of.
Unfortunately, it has very little to do with gear.
It’s to do with simple tasks (such as watching your feet, not getting cleaved, interrupting spell casts or following the most basic typed instructions) being considered “too difficult/complicated/unforgiving”.
I’ve tested Morchok on the PTR and it’s the most embarrassingly easy boss this game has ever seen.
I cannot support this direction of free rewards.
Nobody with the games best interests at heart could support it.
Currency grinding should be removed entirely.
I could almost get on board with this, but the loot tables are currently awful and force dependence on other sources for gearing up (no spirit cloth in Firelands, anyone?).
Personally, I’d put currencies on normal level cap dungeons so that they’re quick and easy to farm, while leaving heroic dungeons at raid tier difficulty with epic rewards in tune with their difficulty.
So what DO you think would be acceptable?
The thing is, I can’t get on board with suggestions that “Blizzard don’t care” or “Blizzard only chase money”. It’s obvious they’ll have a business plan to make the game commercially successful, but anyone thinking that the developers don’t want to make the best game they can is deluding themselves.
That said, the current development team is making a worse game by diluting what was wonderful about WoW, in favour of fast-food, no-risk mini games. Here are things I would support (and in direct response to [name removed]):
- Extremely challenging heroic raids (those with the most time and the most skill).
- Challenging normal raids (those with the most time and high skill).
- Challenging heroic dungeons (those with little time, but high skill).
- Challenging level cap dungeons (those with little time, learning group play).
- Level cap questing and group questing (those with various amounts of time, learning own skills and introductory group play).
Hell, I haven’t even touched on the levelling curve, PvP or role play; I could get into website design, guild leadership, professions, fan fiction/art or UI modification as further ways to get involved in the WoW hobby.
Instead, what do we get?
The removal of level cap dungeons, heroic dungeons tuned to be farmed by anyone, PvE scenarios with no role requirement, “speed” runs to further promote mindlessly spamming your way through and the absurd introduction of pet battles that absolutely nobody wanted.
I have said many times, as have others, that the only (repeat ONLY) prerequisite to playing this game is the desire to improve at it and defeat the challenges that are set.
If you disagree with this notion and believe that people should have things handed to them by virtue of their subscription alone, you are the enemy of World of Warcraft and, indeed, gaming in general.
Put an egg in your shoe and beat it.
They need subscriptions to keep developing the game.
This is exactly my problem, Darkalleigh. Rather than taking the hit, Blizzard have proven that enough crying will see them revert any perceived difficulty in the pursuit of ever more subscriptions.
The problem with this is that it alienates players who want to improve, and doesn’t engender any loyalty from those that these “tuning adjustments” are supposedly aimed at.
My content, the seven Firelands raid bosses you are probably referring to, was nerfed into oblivion recently; including the heroic mode setting.
That essentially leaves me with a single raid boss to deal with, as everything else is easy for someone putting in my level of time and my level of effort.
In no world, not even this one, can that be considered fair or reasonable.
You and I have discussed this at length already, [name removed]. You’ll recall my nonplussed response due to boredom with the content, but there was simply no reasonable justification for the nerfs to heroic mode.
It was perverse.
Have you forgotten PvP?
I’ve concentrated on PvE because that’s where the dumbing down is happening; PvP, on the other hand, is as easy or difficult as the players on the other team make it.
I do, however, concede that you’re absolutely right – PvP players should not be discounted, and I apologise if that’s the impression you’ve gotten from any of my posts. Personally, I feel the dissolution of world PvP keenly and would love to see some fresh thinking that reinvigorates it.
Alas, that is also likely to be blighted by a prolonged outburst of forum wailing.
Good job getting rid of players with disabilities.
Ah, the "heart string" argument - nice try.
I distinctly recall reading a post on the US forums, written by a father who was terminally ill with a multitude of problems. While other fathers were out playing baseball with their sons, or watching hockey matches, he was at a computer playing WoW with his. The game gave him the opportunity to spend time with his son, to pass on those anecdotes of fatherly advice, and to generally "be" a father to his son.
Personally, I found this story an inspiration. It's why I would put VP on normal dungeons, for example, or why I would make levelling challenging and fun or why I would make UI changes to help out players with mental or physical disabilities. Instead, UI resources are being wasted ripping off Pokemon.
It may interest you to learn that I took part in the 5x5 project started by Matt McCurley at WoW Insider, a project designed specifically to help out disabled players. I wrote a blog post about how GM's and RL's can notice players with autism spectrum disorders and how best they can help.
I don't need to remind you that players with disabilities or other difficulties deserve to have the same fun as anyone else. What I feel I MUST remind you, is that disabled players are people too; they do not want mollycoddled, they do not want patronised and they do not want made to feel that they are less than able bodied or minded people.
The next time you wish to play this card on anyone, bear in mind you don't have the slightest clue who I am or what real-life issues I may have direct or indirect experience of.
I took part in the 5x5 project for a reason.
With that archived, I now take the time to answer my detractors from below under the hope that they bothered to read and grasp where my standpoint is, and that they have the self-assurance to see past their own indignation.
I shan’t hold my breath.
Gunboat: I’ve not decided to quit yet – if I do, tell me what server you’re on and you can have it.
Kadomi: I hope the commentary referencing “casual” answers your questions. You’ve argued for many of the same things I have, so mind how you go.
Copra: You have gotten the point; this is NOT a crusade against casual players, it’s a crusade against those who resolutely refuse to be competent.
Ratshag: Trying to patronize someone, while simultaneously role playing an orc and completely missing the point, does you no favours.
Psynister: If winning the Internet requires indignation at a post you don’t understand, you’re welcome to continue handing out the medals.
Unknown: Absolutely. I hope my entries above highlight that I definitely think so, and I apologise for omitting them. I also included the reason why, but that’s no excuse.
Wilhelm Arcturus: Hopefully the above extracts will enlighten your misunderstanding, too. “Hell is a grasp of logic”, not the musings of mindless people.
Oxfxalorum: Once again, I hope the above answers your concerns. I would never ostracise those who casually do things different to me. That would be stupid and, worse, detrimental to the community I’ve long since felt homesick about the loss of.
Anonymous: Thank you for seeing the point; reward should equal risk and, at the moment, it’s cheapening the experience due to the fact it doesn’t.
Faeldray: See above comments to Oxfxalorum and Kadomi. I apologise for any misunderstanding.
Anonymous: You’re free to your opinion. Ironic, isn’t it, that I’m not allowed to suggest what you should do, but the same doesn’t apply in reverse. Nice.
Icy Wiz: Not yet, but Gunboat already has dibs on my gold.
And that concludes this secondary entry on one of my most cathartic posts ever. You are not inclined to agree with me, nor are you demanded to post “objectively” via my subjective preferences. But if you can’t be bothered to read my additions, or can’t be bothered to fully understand the points I’m trying to make, you are not entitled to your indignant assessment of my motives because you haven’t the slightest clue what they are.
Frankly, some of you should know better.