No, I'm not kidding. This isn't for the faint of heart. I'm Thylacine, by the way, and you really need to read the entire thread (not just the OP).
Read this.
Ultimately, this is what reasonable people with developed social capabilities are fighting against.
Get around the community and wish everyone good luck. It's time to stamp out shit like this.
Running wild through Azeroth from the perspective of a Protection warrior.
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I couldn't finish most pages, such a load of absolutely sexist tosh, who can't handle it when 'THE WOMAN' beats them on dps, if indeed they've ever spoken to one. However, from my perspective, there are some points.
ReplyDeleteI get a lot of good-natured ribbing about being one of the two females in my raiding team (of a roster of 14 for MoP by the way, how's that for demographics??) I give it back too against the guys, as I always have.
There's an extremely silly girl who is a social who is constantly in the huff and seems to think she should be in the raid team purely because she has boobs. The guys just laugh at her on voice comms because it's such a stupid concept. This is what people like me and the other girl are working against. Along with the apparently accepted convention that 'gurls r healers lol'. Don't even get me started on that one!
When I first started out applying to raiding guilds, Berti told me not to even tell people I was female if I wanted to be taken seriously and added to a raid squad on my own merits. My first guild didn't use voice comms so it never even came up. The presumption then (and it probably still is now) was that if I perform my job to the high standard I always do, then I am probably a male. People are always surprised that I play so well, such is the state of endemic sexism within WoW.
I don't think I've done half the things girls do, but I can thoroughly agree with some of the sentiments shared. I personally despise raiding with other women, and the success rate of a raid squad I think is generally attributed to how much drama a guild can weather to achieve it's goals. And sadly, the LOOK AT ME I AM A FEMALE GAMER'S (instead of females who play games) bring drama wherever they go by pushing against the others. This is the same in reality; I cannot stand groups of women and their incessant screeching about shit I don't care about.
What women need to learn to do is stop playing up the differences and accept that all you are in WoW is your response time between your brain and the keyboard/mouse. Do these faster than anyone and you'll be top, regardless of hoisting these things on your chest out the way.
I can totally accept why certain points appear realistic at first glance, but then become utterly ridiculous when you think about them properly. For me, the "I've got norks I should raid" argument falls apart the second a GM/raid leader says "no, you'll raid when you show the capability" (assuming it's a competitive raid guild you're in).
ReplyDeleteIt's not a "girl problem". It's a management problem. If a raid leader can't stop that type of thing, THEY are the problem and not the girl.
Maybe it's just me, but I can't accept someone blaming female gamers for drama when, should a bloke behave in a similar way (and they do), they're managed properly in most cases. It sounds to me that the GM in Yermaw is dealing with this correctly and I wish more would behave the same way. Should a girl join a raid team and start being disruptive, they get sat out for being disruptive.
Not "because girls are disruptive".
The whole thing is an absolute flunk in guild management, and making girls the scapegoat.
It's very, very sad and tragically indicative of societal problems in general with those who are different.
It's not okay.
I'm absolutely baffled. I can't believe the amount of people in that thread that seriously say "females = drama" (as if it's some sort of different species, "females") and "women are attention seekers". + many that believe that they are terrible players.
ReplyDeleteWhat about this one?
"Menstrual cramps / PMS can lead to "complicated" attendance".
So because some women happen to be unlucky and might not be available to raid one or two days a month, it's better to shun them altogether? I mean, why play in the first place? It didn't have something to do with having fun, right? Nah, it's a full-time job.
>.<
I must admit that I couldn't read further than page 4, even though I've really been trying.
Luckily, being a woman myself, I can say that I raid endgame in a fairly hardcore guild, and feel very much appreciated by the rest of my team. I'm the main player of my class and am often sought out for advice. I love my class! Yes, I happen to be a girl, and there are more men than women in my group, but doesn't mean more than a plain fact - just like that I'm Dutch and like playing a lore-master. It doesn't matter, and that's how it should be.
I feel sorry for the nice guys and girls that (apparently) have to deal with the high amount of immature players in WoW, and I feel lucky that I haven't encountered any of this stuff in the main MMO I play myself (LotRO).
Is WoW worse for this than other games? I'm not sure. I think it potentially could be purely via the fact it has more subscribers, a far lower level of entry for group content, and probably a far higher percentage of group content that requires scheduling and management.
ReplyDeleteWho knows?
But, yeah - disadvantaging girls because they have a difficult couple of days every month is ridiculous. It's funny, as the best officer I ever had as GM was a girl and most of the lasting friends I've made in WoW are all girls. As an amusing anecdote, the new guild I joined?
Yeah, easily half of the main raiding group are female including the main tank, a role "not for girls".
Idiots are bad enough. Idiots that shove blame onto others for their idiocy? That's REALLY bad. Idiots that try and shove their idiocy onto others via hard-nosed bigotry?
The worst kind of person.
Cant really say if its worse or not in other MMO games as i have mainly played only WoW as MMO-fantasy game and i am male but need to agree with Zell that it potentially could be.
ReplyDeleteI have played WoW now since 2005 summer on both PvP and RP servers. Casually and more HC depending from life situation/intrest/etc. Since i started i have played with both genders, good and bad, saw many different players and can say that it doesnt matter if you have cock or cunt.
Its all about person, what kind of personality they have/experience/willing to learn new things etc..
When i lead raid only thing what matters to me is if that person is able to pull their "weight" in raid, performance in role he/she is. Quite shortly said but hopefully you got my point ;D